From fork-admin@xent.com Fri Sep 20 11:32:30 2002 Return-Path: Delivered-To: yyyy@localhost.example.com Received: from localhost (jalapeno [127.0.0.1]) by jmason.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A7A0316F03 for ; Fri, 20 Sep 2002 11:32:29 +0100 (IST) Received: from jalapeno [127.0.0.1] by localhost with IMAP (fetchmail-5.9.0) for jm@localhost (single-drop); Fri, 20 Sep 2002 11:32:29 +0100 (IST) Received: from xent.com ([64.161.22.236]) by dogma.slashnull.org (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8JHLgC29973 for ; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 18:21:43 +0100 Received: from lair.xent.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by xent.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EBFB229410C; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 10:18:05 -0700 (PDT) Delivered-To: fork@example.com Received: from panacea.canonical.org (ns1.canonical.org [209.115.72.29]) by xent.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B0D0329409C for ; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 10:17:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: by panacea.canonical.org (Postfix, from userid 1004) id E51EC3F522; Thu, 19 Sep 2002 13:18:04 -0400 (EDT) From: Kragen Sitaker To: fork@example.com Cc: webmaster@worldwidewords.org Subject: Re: Avast there matey Message-Id: <20020919171804.GA18065@canonical.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.28i Sender: fork-admin@xent.com Errors-To: fork-admin@xent.com X-Beenthere: fork@example.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Friends of Rohit Khare List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 13:18:04 -0400 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-4.8 required=5.0 tests=AWL,EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,KNOWN_MAILING_LIST,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, USER_AGENT,USER_AGENT_MUTT version=2.50-cvs X-Spam-Level: Owen Byrne writes: > [quoting http://www.quinion.com/words/qa/qa-shi2.htm] > *SHIVER MY TIMBERS* > > /From Tad Spencer/: "Please could you tell me where the phrase /shiver > my timbers/ originated?" > > This is one of those supposedly nautical expressions that seem to be > better known through a couple of appearances in fiction than by any > actual sailors' usage. > > It's an exclamation that may allude to a ship striking some rock or > other obstacle so hard that her timbers shiver, or shake, so implying a > calamity has occurred. It is first recorded as being used by Captain > Frederick Marryat in /Jacob Faithful/ in 1835: "I won't thrash you Tom. > Shiver my timbers if I do". It seems implausible to me that "shiver" here means "to shake"; I don't recall seeing the word used transitively in that sense, and web1913 lists that sense as "v. i.", or intransitive. The transitive sense of "shiver", which we no longer use but which people used widely in the 1800s (web1913 doesn't even list it as archaic or obsolete), means "to shatter into splinters, normally with a blow". Shivering a boat's timbers, of course, leaves you with no boat. (Shivering some of them, which will happen if you hit a rock hard enough, leaves you with a sinking boat.) So, "Shiver my timbers if I do," can be reasonably interpreted as a more vivid way of saying, "May I die suddenly if I do." The interpretation suggested by Quinion, "May my boat be damaged," neither makes as much sense in context nor obeys the normal rules of grammar. I've sent a copy of this to Quinion.