139 lines
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139 lines
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From fork-admin@xent.com Tue Sep 17 11:30:05 2002
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From: "John Hall" <johnhall@evergo.net>
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To: "'Stephen D. Williams'" <sdw@lig.net>
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Cc: <fork@spamassassin.taint.org>, <lea@lig.net>
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Subject: RE: Slaughter in the Name of God
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Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 20:11:10 -0700
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> From: Stephen D. Williams [mailto:sdw@lig.net]
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> Sent: Monday, September 16, 2002 7:42 PM
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> >1. Which religion and how it is currently being expressed matters.
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> >
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> A) Which religion is it that can claim no foul actions in its past?
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> Certainly not Christianity, Islam, etc.
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Hence the qualifier 'current'.
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> B) "How it is currently being expressed" amounts to a tacit
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> acknowledgement that the sophistication of the society involved and
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> people's self-limiting reasonableness are important to avoid primitive
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> expression. This leads to the point that religion and less
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> sophisticated societies are a dangerous mix. It also tends to invoke
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> the image of extremes that might occur without diligent maintenance of
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> society.
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The tacit acknowledgement and self-limiting you speak of is not a given
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or a function of 'sophistication' but is primarily a feature of
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(current) Western Civilization. Of course, 'sophisticated' and 'Western
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Civilization' are essentially equivalent IMHO. But it need not be so.
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> D) The Northern Ireland Protestant vs. Catholic feud, recently more or
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> less concluded, is not completely unlike this kind of friction
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generated
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> by splitting society too much along religious lines. One Post article
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> pointed out that the problem basically stemmed from the vertical
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> integration of areas along religious lines all the way to schools,
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> government, political party, etc. (Of course both cases have a
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heritage
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> of British conquest, but who doesn't?)
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And sometimes the religious component is a fa<66>ade for an equally
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dangerous ethnic affiliation. Hindu extremism isn't about the Hindu
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religious theology as far as I can see. It is a peg to hang an ethnic
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identity and identity politics on.
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Muslim extremism appears to have a far greater connection to theology.
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> 'Northern Ireland is a British province of green valleys and
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> cloud-covered hills whose 1.6 million people are politically and
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> religiously divided. About 54 percent of the population is Protestant,
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> and most Protestants are unionists who want the province to remain
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part
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> of Britain. The Roman Catholic minority is predominantly republican,
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or
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> nationalist; they want to merge with the Republic of Ireland to the
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south.
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Yep, all because the Scots ate oats and starved their Irish out long
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ago, while the English preferred wheat and that doesn't grow so well in
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Ireland. That and the introduction of potatoes saved the Irish as
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Irish.
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> That's fine, as it would be an inappropriate concentration. It would
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be
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> difficult to address the issues raised here in a clean way. I'd be
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> happy with an acknowledgement that the connection is there.
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Oh, I think we are in a war with wide aspects of the Muslim religion. I
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know it is there, but it just might not be appropriate to admit it
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publicly.
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> >3. US Leadership remains reflexively multi-cultural.
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> >
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> This is ok to a point, as long as it doesn't shy away from logical,
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> objective analysis of when a society could be seriously improved in
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> certain ways.
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I didn't say this was a *good* thing. With the exception of ethnic
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restaurants, I can generally be counted on to oppose anything labeled
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'multi-cultural'.
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> >I didn't say burning the train was a good thing. I said I understood
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it
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> >wasn't a spontaneous attack on people who had done no wrong.
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> >
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>
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> True, although I don't think you were as clear originally. :-)
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I'm sure I wasn't.
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